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helter skelter
#1
neil young is apparently the 'godfather of grunge', apperantly. so does that make paul mccartney the 'godfather of metal' being that he wrote 'helter skelter'? which was the first real hard rock/metal song to reach the masses.

also, it shows how talented he was/is as a songwriter when you look at the transformation from 1965s 'yesterday' to 1968s 'helter skelter'.

ive also tried to read into the lyrics of helter skelter,piggies,blackird and the musical collage of revolution, and cant for the life of me figure out just why it became a catalyst for the Manson Family muders, it seems to just be an arguement put up by the defence lawyers at his trial that was never founded as actual fact.
"BTO....Bachman,Turner,Overweight
They were big in the 70s....for five minutes,on a Saturday,after lunch..."  -  Me 2014.


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#2
Most of the answers to Manson's disturbed thinking come from his interpretation of Revelations in the Bible

Much of that particular book are confused and strange: However the main parts are: that according to Manson, there are references to " Four Angles" who will come into the world and bring great changes

ie The Beatles ( Could be any one else too but hey this is a nutter !!!!)

Look at the following quotes : from the literature on him:


Manson was an avid reader of the Bible and often quoted from the Book of Revelation. In December 1968, he and Charles Watson listened to the new Beatle's album, The White Album, and Manson became obsessed with some of the songs, especially Helter Skelter and Revolution 9. His interpretation of the lyrics, woven in with his view of Revelations, resulted in a philosophy which envisioned an apocalypse brought on by a race war of blacks killing whites.
According to his philosophy, the blacks would win, but would ultimately turn to Manson and The Family to help lead the new world.

The Fifth Angel:


If Charlie actually believed in his teachings or if he just thought it all sounded impressive, is not known. What is known is that he convinced many that he was "the fifth angel" (Verse 1 of the Book of Revelation) who would be given "the key to the pit of the abyss." The only problem was that the revolution was taking too long and Charlie was getting anxious. In 1969, he began introducing his new theory that the blacks needed help to kick off the race war and it was up to the family to help.


Manson believes that the references to the Fifth Angel in Revelations is him. Strangely it is Piggies that seems to be of greatest significance to the Manson family but, that is down played in this quote.................

He also believes that he four angels will talk to the fifth angle and give him messages :

These messages are to spark off a change in the world................A race war between black and white.

The key songs to look at are:

Revolution 9 ( In his mind the key to this is its resemblance to Revalations) this is a vision of what the war will be like ...........

Blackbird: This is his clue to the participants and maybe targets.

Piggies : This is one of the most significant...............This contained the clues of whom to attack and how ...............It was also the words founds at the scene of Sharon Tate's murder..........in particular he mentions a clue being the lines and uses this as a justification to inciting racial hatred.......................He claims that this is the message that the four angels give ................I leave you to interpret the piggies bit .............but he sees black against white here and vice-versa.

Have you seen the little piggies
Crawling in the dirt
And for all the little piggies
Life is getting worse
Always having dirt to play around in.

Have you seen the bigger piggies
In their starched white shirts
You will find the bigger piggies
Stirring up the dirt
Always have clean shirts to play around in.

In their sties with all their backing
They don't care what goes on around
In their eyes there's something lacking
What they need's a damn good whacking.

Everywhere there's lots of piggies
Living piggy lives
You can see them out for dinner
With their piggy wives
Clutching forks and knives to eat their bacon


Helter skelter is also mentioned as the key as to when the killing should start. I don't really understand why or have not seen anything that unwraps this one.

As I say this is the thinking of a mad man but this is the basis of what he claims to be the story.
However Manson says that Helter Skelter are the key words that incited him to start this round of killing................................

Of what ones knows about Manson:

"Manson was a small wry man, who was generally unattractive which, further enhanced by his poor personal hygiene, yet he was able to maneuver his way into what is generally known as closed doors in Hollywood. He was hired by Universal Studios to consult on a movie because of his ability to quickly quote passages in the Bible. He and the Family were invited to parties given by wealthy famous people. As he moved along those with astounding wealth, his dreams of becoming a famous musician grew."

Seems to me that he was a complete failure in life and that this mad idea was all that he could do to make his mark. ( Strange that in the last few weeks Mark Chapman has also said that this seemed to be his motivation to become famous and that wsa to kil someone high profile to achieve it ..............Perhaps its that phase of the moon ????)

Even after many years in a corrective institution, he still seems to have a strange view of religion and what God is trying to say to him.......

He is still an active musician and has released albums from his prison cell ..................

Still who knows what lurks in the mind of mad men ?Cool

As a last thought:both Paul and George were quoted as being the most disturbed that they have ever been in their lives that anyone could see this message in anything that they have done musically...:eek:
Nice to be able to go back to trust and friendship!!!!!!!!!

It's a mixed up sensation this being alive
Oh! it wears a man down into the ground
It's the strangest elation
I can't describe it
Oh it leaves a man weary
It makes a man frown.
.............................Chris Simpson ( "Mixed Up Sensations" 1975 Martin's Cafe )
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#3
......but is paul mccartney 'the godfather of metal'?
"BTO....Bachman,Turner,Overweight
They were big in the 70s....for five minutes,on a Saturday,after lunch..."  -  Me 2014.


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#4
This is what you asked for help with , so that is what I produced guidance on:


"I 've also tried to read into the lyrics of helter skelter,piggies,blackird and the musical collage of revolution, and cant for the life of me figure out just why it became a catalyst for the Manson Family murders, it seems to just be an arguement put up by the defence lawyers at his trial that was never founded as actual fact."

:biggrin::biggrin::biggrin::happy:Cool

Ask for the question " Is PMc C the God Father of Metal.....................A good listen to many of the singles that did not make the charts and the music of the lesser known bands from all around the world would seem to indicate that P M.C might be the great grand son of the father "

If you want to know what I mean .........down load "Something Else" by Eddie Cochran and listen carefully to the Drum and Bass players contribution , They bury many heavy metal combinations and this was in the 50s!
Nice to be able to go back to trust and friendship!!!!!!!!!

It's a mixed up sensation this being alive
Oh! it wears a man down into the ground
It's the strangest elation
I can't describe it
Oh it leaves a man weary
It makes a man frown.
.............................Chris Simpson ( "Mixed Up Sensations" 1975 Martin's Cafe )
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#5
i'll go put on Eddies 'best of' cd right now
"BTO....Bachman,Turner,Overweight
They were big in the 70s....for five minutes,on a Saturday,after lunch..."  -  Me 2014.


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#6
first hard rock song? Kinks 'You really got me'

But Helter Skelter is definitely important in the evolution from You Really Got Me to the likes of 'Dazed and Confused' and 'Black Sabbath'
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#7
You may have a point with the Kinks track being hard rock ......but I feel it is not he first hard rock song..............Look into the work of Joe Meek.............quite a while before You really got me Joe was producing hard rock sounds in his studio..............he was also one or two of the people who would become the hard rockers of the late 60's and seventies as session men...........for example Jimmy Page !:wink:Cool
Nice to be able to go back to trust and friendship!!!!!!!!!

It's a mixed up sensation this being alive
Oh! it wears a man down into the ground
It's the strangest elation
I can't describe it
Oh it leaves a man weary
It makes a man frown.
.............................Chris Simpson ( "Mixed Up Sensations" 1975 Martin's Cafe )
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#8
this is good Goth and Gryph, had i thought a bit more about my initial thread i would have said 'you really got me' was up there along with 'my generation'
"BTO....Bachman,Turner,Overweight
They were big in the 70s....for five minutes,on a Saturday,after lunch..."  -  Me 2014.


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